Posts by Doubting Bro

36

Were You Happy That Jack Barr Of The GB Died?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i read that some are quite happy that another gb bites the dust.. i think of my "faithful" elderly jw mother who helped many many families come into the "truth".

she's an intelligent woman.

however, she's blinded by her beliefs (being in a cult).

Doubting Bro

BB - I agree with what you said.

Minimus - You know, I never really thought about what Franz did but now that I reflect on it, what courage it took to basically leave security to jump into the unknown at his age. He could have just as easily been like Barr and lived out his life at Bethel. We know the GB has great latitude to disagree with current teaching and it could have been very tempting to work within the system as a force for change. We all know that it probably wouldn't have worked and certainly Franz felt like he didn't have a shot at reform or he would have likely taken that route.

Like LWT said, we all die. I'm neither sad nor happy since I didn't personally know him. I'm sure family and friends are sorry he's gone and will miss him. Of course, at 97 he certainly lived a long life.

In terms of his participation on the GB, it doesn't really matter. It does mark the end of GB 1.0 and I would imagine that we'll see several appointments in 2011 to push the number up from 7 to maybe 12. I'm sure they'll have no problem finding a replacement just like our employers would have no problem finding a replacement for any of us.

I expect more of the same and seriously doubt that anyone new will rock the boat.

5

Should true Christians listen to symposiums?

by sir82 in

jw
friends

anyone whose been to a circuit assembly or district convention over the past 5 years knows how the society has gone absolutely ape-$#!+ crazy over the word "symposium".. there's a symposium every morning...every afternoon....every multi-talk unit is introduced as a "symposium"...the km articles hyping the assemblies ramble on about how we can look forward with great enthusiasm to all the symposiums....at lunchtime, the talk is all about "oh what a great symposium"...symposium this, symposium that..... anyways, i'm currently reading "the jews in the time of jesus" by stephen wylen, an entry-level discussion of jewish belief in the 2nd temple period concentrating on, not surprisingly, the jews in the time of jesus.. in one chapter he is comparing jewish ritual meals to christian ritual meals, and how the seder morphed into the eucharist.. he talks how the seder was done in the first century, and compares it to a typical hellenistic (greek) banquet.. here's what i found amusing:.

"at the hellenistic banquet the participants sat on sofas around a low table, dining at leisure.

meanwhile, they discussed a prepared topic.

Doubting Bro

Symposiums would actually be interesting if they served wine inbetween!

18

I feel like a coward weakling. Not like a man. It doesn't feel good.

by easyreader1970 in

jw
friends

i'm trying to figure out a way to deal with these feelings of cowardice, worthlessness, unmanliness, etc.. i'm not afraid of anyone or even what would happen to me (nothing), but i do not want to witness the utter destruction of my family.

so i shut up and go along.

i am often reminded of the scene in ben hur when charleton heston's bravery is threatened with the loss of his family.

Doubting Bro

easyreader1970 - I realize this may be of little consolation but I know exactly how you feel. I could have just as easily written that post. I wish I knew how to fix it or offer some words of wisdom. If we leave and our families break apart, the WTS gets to demonize us as apostates who hate their familes and use it to rally the local congregation and thus wins. If we stay, trudge through the JW parts of life at the meetings and occasional service group to keep below the radar, the WTS keeps their numbers up and thus wins.

The more I reflect on the situation, the more I want to impute sinister motives to the WTS management. Folks in our situation really are between a rock and a hard place. I take solace from the fact that the retention rates are so poor among the JW youth that there's a better than average chance the kids of folks in our spot will make the break when they get the first opportunity.

At least now, you can influence your kids to do as many normal things as possible and above all to avoid getting baptised at least prior to 18.

33

The organisation wants our money

by Heartofaboy in

jw
friends

has anyone heard that at the end of the theocratic service meeting last night the organisation asked for money, pensions, properties, shares, insurance policies in fact anything of any financial value?.

it upset some people attending the meeting.. .

Doubting Bro

Yeah, it was a part on the Service Meeting. The WTS actually as a brochure on "charitable planning". I think the article is always in the Nov WT and this part is given every year. A slight encouragement was a look my wife gave me in the middle of the part. She kind of rolled her eyes and looked annoyed when they were talking about leaving money to the WTS in your will.

I will say that I'm also getting lots of solicitation mailers from many not for profit orgs this time of the year. The difference is many of them actually provide society with some sort of service as opposed to what the WTS does.

But, of course, they NEVER beg for money or pass the plate! LOL - it doesn't occur to them that this is in the same boat?

34

Is the information on JWfacts.com accurate?

by Nobleheart in

jw
friends

i'm researching and going through so much material to try and find out whether jw doctrines and beliefs are based on the bible, as well as if they're consistent.

i'm a jw currently and i have many doubts at the moment.

fortunately this site is helping me so much, as there's always someone who's posted the same question i had in mind.

Doubting Bro

Nobelheart - 1st, welcome to the board!!

The JW Facts author actually posts here on a regular basis (JWFacts is his user name). I would say this his website is probably the best most objective discussion of JW beliefs that I've seen. He's also open to any corrections and will sometimes post articles here for feedback.

His page on blood helped me see how offbase the WTS policy is and I was still a very active JW at the time. For what it's worth, I'd highly recommend it. But, do yourself a favor and look up the references he provides to "make sure".

18

Internet-Free Break, Tell Me What I Missed

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

i was internet-free, phone-free, television-free from wednesday noon up until today, monday morning.

the wife and i celebrated our 20 years of marriage during the turkey holiday and got away from it all.

tell me, someone, if i missed anything important in the news and what stuff i may have missed on jwn..

Doubting Bro

Happy anniversary Mr & Mrs OTWO!! 20 years is quite an accomplishment. Here's to 20 more!!

38

KM Jan 2011 Family Worship

by dozy in

there is a big insert in the jan kingdom ministry about the family worship night (which has evolved new capital letters - like governing body.).

some helpful suggestions include the head of the household putting an agenda on the fridge door a few days ahead for the family to "build excitement and anticipation" (i kid you not.

) the provision is compared to the sabbath arrangement as a gift from god.

Doubting Bro

They've always said that family heads should have some sort of family study. The FWN was simply a ruse to take attention away from eliminating the separate book study night. All they have to do is not mentioned it or mention it in passing (like the family study) and problem solved.

Clearly, very few families are using the free night for FWN. And, there's no way to police it other than asking the family head who will always answer yes.

Honestly, JWs have lost any real passion for their religion and apathy is at an alltime high (in my opinion). I'm not sure why they thought the FWN would help, other than give JWs a night off which made most happy but did nothing to cure the apathy.

Hey, Bethel monitors if you want to reignite the enthusiasm among the rank & file either: 1) set a new date for the great trib to begin or 2) make the meetings more interesting and introduce the concept of community service as a form of sacred service so JWs can feel good about something.

On second thought, carry on!!

45

Nobody forced us to believe. We CHOSE to follow their crap advice.

by hamsterbait in

have you noticed that the recent trolls are now claiming that if anybody drew conclusions or made decisions based on what the society was printing, it was their own fault?.

kind of "we didn't force you to believe what we said or adjust your life because of it.

you chose to think we were teaching the end would come in <insert time range>".

Doubting Bro

While I was a born-in, I still put most of the blame for being a life long JW on myself. Yes, there was pressure to get baptized but I actually believed so I can't say that it was the pressure that caused me to do it. I should have investigated as a teen but I didn't. I could have walked away as a young adult or at least investigated nagging doubts but I didn't. I had chances but instead chose to go deeper into the religion.

Now, I will say that I always regretted not going to college right after high school, even as a true believer. I often tell people when they ask me why I didn't go straight out of high scholl is that I got bad advice from well meaning but short sighted individuals and I took it. However, I did something about that and am now a college graduate.

I continue to chose to attend not because I believe, which I don't. But because the price is too high to walk away. This choice isn't without cost either but it's what I feel I have to do.

But, I don't think anyone forced me to believe. They may force me to not speak out or force me to pretend and fly under the radar but not to believe. I just trusted the wrong folks. I'll tell you what, I won't ever do that again.

46

North Korea just attacked South Korea, wonder where this will head........

by miseryloveselders in

jw
friends

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40329269/ns/world_news-asiapacific/.

seoul north korea bombarded a south korean island with dozens of artillery shells tuesday in one of the fiercest attacks on its neighbor since the korean war ended in 1953.. .

there's more to the story, but copying and pasting was somewhat awkward.

Doubting Bro

This is serious. With Seoul (New York-ish sized city) sitting so close, I sure hope cooler heads prevail. China needs to tell N Korea to back off.

33

Is it wrong of me to think of the GB, the Writing Department, Bethelites, Pioneers, as moochers, and leeching bloodsuckers?

by miseryloveselders in

jw
friends

i'm exhausted right now.

it's been a very long day.

both physically, and mentally, althought the latter otweighted the former by tons.

Doubting Bro

I certainly agree with you regarding the CO level and above. To james_woods point, I have seen some COs do the best they could to minimize expenses and I've also seen COs spend lots of money on weekly expenses even though they knew the average JW in that particular congo was hurting financially. Interestingly enough, the COs who were disliked by the BOE the most ended up being the ones who spent the most money. Obviously, their lack of caring the the publishers and elders showed up in both how they treated the members and how they treated the members money.

MLE is totally right about elders hating the COs visit. Now, I just relax and laugh as I watch them walk on eggshells for a week!!

What I think is even more ironic is that JWs claim there is no clergy/laity distinction, that everyone works and supports themselves, yet you have COs/DOs/Bethel heavies up to and including the GB who don't work at ALL.

I can tell you from personal experience that even loyal JWs take note of this situation and have some level of resentment. Especially against COs who come twice a year, tell them what losers they are, what bad parents they are and how they're letting Jehovah down and then hop in their nice leased Buicks and drive away.

I would love to see the WTS eliminate the CO position just to see these guys taken down a peg and have to actually work for a living.